Saw X Producers Reveal Spiral's Biggest Flaw And The Future Of Jigsaw - Exclusive Interview

For two decades, producers Mark Burg and Oren Koules have produced every single movie in the "Saw" franchise. After taking a different direction with 2021's "Spiral: From the Book of Saw" — which found Chris Rock pursuing a murderer who operated in the style of Jigsaw, with no direct connection to the legendary killer — the producers have now shepherded a 10th entry, "Saw X," to the screen, bringing many classic elements of the series back into play.

Chief among those, of course, is Tobin Bell as Jigsaw/John Kramer, the retired architect who designs his horrific traps to both punish and test his victims for past transgressions. Also back is Amanda (Shawnee Smith), John's very first victim in "Saw," who functions as his apprentice. And before you ask how this is happening — since both John and Amanda are long dead in the series — "Saw X" goes back in time, taking place between the first two movies.

The story opens with a despondent John, dying of brain cancer, signing up for an experimental treatment at a secret medical lab in Mexico. But when he discovers that the whole operation is a scam meant to part desperately ill people from their money, he and Amanda manage to round up the grifters and put each of them through the wringer: One victim must decide between losing her leg or her head, while another has to break her own bones to avoid getting the skin seared off her body.

In other words, this is vintage "Saw," which Burg and Koules say is what audiences want from this long-running franchise. "Part of it is our consistency," Koules told Looper in our exclusive interview. "People can check in for an hour and a half, two hours, and they know what to expect."

This one was in development for a few years. Was there always an intention to do something like "Spiral," which is a little more off the beaten track, and then circle back and get back to the roots?

Mark Burg: We thought we were going to do this movie in 2018. We were developing it with Josh [Stolberg] and Pete [Goldfinger], the writers. Then, Chris Rock met Michael Burns at a wedding, and next thing you know, Michael Burns — who's one of the heads of Lionsgate — was calling Oren and myself saying, "Hey, I just met Chris Rock. He loves 'Saw.' He has an idea for a 'Saw' movie he wants to do — call him."

That took a two- or three-year journey with "Spiral," between COVID and everything else. We decided we would do "Spiral," and we tried to. It was "Saw," but it's not "Saw." It can't be a "Saw" movie without Tobin Bell. So we did that, and then we decided we'd come back and tell the story that we wanted to before we got involved with that.

Even when he's not been the central character, Tobin and Jigsaw have always lurked around the edges. Was it easy to get him to come back and be front and center in this one?

Oren Koules: He's thrilled to show his acting chops. The first 25 minutes of the movie, he's [just] John Kramer. It's by far the longest he's ever been in a movie. It shows his chops, and he loves his character. He loves the transition from John Kramer to Jigsaw in this one.

Burg: Tobin will read the script. First, he'd say he has to read the script, and he'd read it, and he'd be like, "Okay, I love this, but John wouldn't say this, and John wouldn't say that, and Jigsaw would say it this way..." He's kind of two different people. He'll sit there and literally rewrite his dialogue in a way that it is him, and he's generally always right. It may be a little bit different, and the writers are great to bring him in and let him help pre-craft his character.

This one fills in some gaps in the mythology, ties up some loose ends, and leaves a couple of other things open. Where do you go from here? Because in the timeline, this leads into "Saw II."

Burg: Yes, it takes place between "Saw" and "Saw II."

Do you continue on this path, or do you jump forward in time again? What do you think happens next?

Koules: We don't really think about it until the movie opens, but if we had to, there are some story elements here that we'd like to finish up. When you get to the end of this movie, not everybody's dead, and you've got to figure out what do you do with a bunch of loose ends. If we were going to do another one, it would probably be a continuation of this storyline.

Why do you guys think people keep responding to this IP and these characters and this name after 20 years?

Burg: We started shooting the first movie on September 22, 2003. It was our first day of principal photography.

Koules: It's 20 years. I think part of it is our consistency ... People can check in for an hour and a half, two hours, and they know what to expect. Whatever experience they're getting out of it, we're very consistent; they love their experience, and that's one of the reasons why. We try to keep it consistent for the fans.

"Saw X" starts a new game in theaters this Friday, September 29.

This interview has been edited for clarity.